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Rive's Uncharted Settlements
by: Rive Caedo
date posted: Sep 27, 2005 9:41 PM  | 
updated: Oct 05, 2005 10:28 PM
Knights of the old old Republic
-Update- Check below the bold line to read the orignal query :)

Wow, some really great thoughts in the intial comments! In particular I'd like to point out Kenobi-fan's:

"As to whether a Jedi needs a lightsaber to define themselves, you only have to look at Luke in ROTJ. Upon defeating Vader and confronting Palpatine, he tosses his lightsaber away to declare, "I am a Jedi, like my father before me." I can think of no greater example of what a Jedi is supposed to be about."

It doesn't really answer the question "Would you like to see stories and such about Jedi before lightsabers were invented?" directly, but it does point out the point I was trying to make. Lightsabers define Jedi in our minds and even within the Star Wars universe the lightsaber would have been the symbol of the Jedi. Even though Jedi aren't just a floating glowstick, many of us can't imagine them without one.

But that is precisely what would make stories about the foundation of the Jedi Order so interesting! Imagine stories of characters with a newfound frightening power to move things with their minds. Of Jedi at odds with one another of how these new powers should be used. Of Jedi trying to recruit new apprentices but being feared by the galaxy at large. Of Jedi having to be "careful" because they aren't nigh blasterproof with their fancy glowstick.

You might get any of the fancy buzzing sounds, flashy lights, contact flares, and blaster deflection we all know and love, but personally, I think there's plenty of ground to cover there in character development, plot, and adding some pages to the Star Wars Timeline. :)

Well now that you've heard my pro-ancient Jedi stories opinion, any new comments?

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Original entry:

About 25,200 Before the Battle of Yavin (Episode IV)

* The Force is discovered by many groups across the galaxy; many dismiss them as mystic crackpots.

About 25,000 years Before the Battle of Yavin (Episode IV)
*The Galactic Constitution is signed. After the signing of this constitution the Galactic Republic and the Jedi Order are founded. Coruscant becomes the Republic's capital.

About 24,500 years Before the Battle of Yavin (Episode IV)

* The first war between the Jedi, the Great Schism, begins when some of their number are drawn to the dark side.

About 24,400 Before the Battle of Yavin (Episode IV)

* The Dark Jedi lose the war and are exiled from the Republic. In the realms beyond the Republic's reach they found the Sith Empire, which remains unknown to rest of the galaxy for almost twenty thousand years.
* A prophecy tells of a Chosen One who will bring "balance to the Force".

About 9,990 years Before the Battle of Yavin (Episode IV)
* Lightsabers are invented.

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In addition to informing readers about the commonly accepted important dates in early Jedi history in the Expanded Universe, I wanted to pose this question to you.

We have about 14,400 years of history to cover in there. Would you be at interested in seeing games/comics/books/A TV Series about the very early Jedi? Most likely weak in the force and lightsaberless (using regular swords, energized in some cases for enhanced power on striking)?

I'll post my thoughts tommorow, don't want to corrupt responders with my own opinion for this one :)
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-=Rive Caedo=-
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  Master_Kenobi17
Takin Over For Talon
date Posted: Sep 27, 2005 9:44 PM
Jedi without lightsabers??? Have you gone mad???:D
  Bomberman6_5
date Posted: Sep 27, 2005 9:53 PM
Yes a lightsaber is like part of the Jedi and nearly everyone will agree that watching Jedi without lightsabers is like Han without his blaster it just won't intrest anyone but maybe thats just me.
  Master_Kenobi17
Takin Over For Talon
date Posted: Sep 27, 2005 10:02 PM
everyone will agree that watching Jedi without lightsabers is like Han without his blaster it just won't intrest anyone

Yeah!! It's like Han without his mouth or Han without Chewie or Han without the Falcon too!!
  Darth Kevinmhk
date Posted: Sep 27, 2005 10:19 PM
is that timeline from theforce.net?
i guess so.

anyway it is possible the first group of Jedi have no lightsabers,
at first they are just studying the Force, not as defender of
galaxy
PadawanQui-GonJoe
The History of the Jedi Knights
date Posted: Sep 28, 2005 12:26 AM
I would say YES!! The history of the Jedi, is of intrest to Me. I feel that the Jedi got there start some were, and way not without Lightsabers!
"Shatterpoint"! Was a story of Jedi(Dark) with out Lightsabers. They were a race of Force sensitive people from Mace's Home planet. OR, Has everyone forgotten this book?
  JadenNightsaber
THX 118?
date Posted: Sep 28, 2005 3:55 AM
A lightsaber is only one weapon that the Jedi have. Back then they may have relied on the force more than there lightsabers. Just a thought. §
  eumesmo1
Does Leia really remember Padmé?
date Posted: Sep 28, 2005 5:17 AM
To the Jedi we know, the lightsaber is the hearth of the Jedi. However in KOTOR when revan is trainig with Bastila we see them training with regular swords, or vibroblades. It's possible that when the Jedi first started to exist (however it's said that the Jedi Order is ancient has time itself...) they didn't have lightsabers. They invented lightsaber to distinguish them. Only a Jedi can use a lightsaber. And yes i think early Jedi where much more powerfull in the force. Many secrets of the Force where lost with the constant wars with the darkside. Only some toughts ;)
  kieranhaylcon
The importance of Episodes 1 through 6 (part 1)
date Posted: Sep 28, 2005 5:19 AM
A Jedi's lightsaber is as Obi-Wan puts it "...this weapon is your life.", it is the staple of the Jedi Order and certainly more than worthy to be known as the most noticeable difference between Jedi and Force users. I believe this to be the main point for this discussion that although the "Jedi" were founded at the formation of the Republic, what we know and love as Jedi are those who have constructed their lightsabers. Even Jedi padawans are not really Jedi until they have completed construction of their lightsabers. Now, that being said I do not think that Jedi who do not have a lightsaber or have lost theirs are not incredibly talented with the Force.
  kieranhaylcon
The importance of Episodes 1 through 6 (part 1)
date Posted: Sep 28, 2005 5:19 AM
(Cont) Look at Yoda who lived out the rest of his life on Dagoba without a lightsaber. Look at Obi-Wan Kenobi who defeated General Grevious without a lightsaber. I personally think it would be a great and interesting thing to see a set of movies or books centering on the early republic and battles between Sith and Jedi as their knowledge of the Force increased, and then to skip ahead a few years and complete it with the Jedi defeating the Sith into the dark regions of the galaxy because of their new "lightsabers". What an idea to have master vs apprentice battling for the first time with these lightsabers discussing the "chosen one" who will bring the Force into balance. Just some thoughts, may the Force be with you.
  Kenobi-fan
The Jundland Wastes Journal
date Posted: Sep 28, 2005 7:05 AM
As to whether a Jedi needs a lightsaber to define themselves, you only have to look at Luke in ROTJ. Upon defeating Vader and confronting Palpatine, he tosses his lightsaber away to declare, "I am a Jedi, like my father before me." I can think of no greater example of what a Jedi is supposed to be about.
  Master_Kenobi17
Takin Over For Talon
date Posted: Sep 28, 2005 9:00 AM
As to whether a Jedi needs a lightsaber to define themselves, you only have to look at Luke in ROTJ. Upon defeating Vader and confronting Palpatine, he tosses his lightsaber away to declare, "I am a Jedi, like my father before me." I can think of no greater example of what a Jedi is supposed to be about.

Good job!!
fett2201980
Fettspawn
date Posted: Sep 28, 2005 11:03 AM
Would I? That is the one thing I love about the Star Wars Universe, I love that there is so much to cover. There is always something new to discover. I am hoping that the T V show will be out soon, but I understand as to why they may take their time. I love that the games even tie into the comics and novels.
  eumesmo1
Does Leia really remember Padmé?
date Posted: Sep 28, 2005 12:04 PM
Kenobi-fan:

Good point. I think we should meditate in what defines a Jedi, is it really the blade? I think my point of view clarified with your comment. Thanks!
  SithLord707
Sith meditation
date Posted: Sep 28, 2005 4:30 PM
i think lightsabers are part of the jedi, no one else can handle them, you need the force to handle a lightsaber, therefore i think jedi invented the lightsabers to distinguish themselves like kenobi-fan said. so i guess there WAS a time when jedis had no saber but i dont know how interesting that would be to watch.]:)
  shatterpoint282
''This Party's Over ''
date Posted: Sep 28, 2005 7:27 PM
When I think of jedi , lightsabers come 2 mind . But it is interesting in Shatterpoint when Mace battles Kar Vastor without his lightsaber.
  Darth Kevinmhk
date Posted: Sep 28, 2005 8:37 PM
Lightsabers are the symbol of the Jedi, the definition of
defenders of peace and justice. But a Jedi do not need
a lightsaber to be a Jedi. Jedi are guided by the Force,
guided by the Code and moral values, when they found
peace and stay calm, feel the Force around them, become
one with it, then lightsabers doesnt really matter.

Lightsabers are part of a Jedi, but Jedi can live without
a lightsaber
  thetorp
date Posted: Sep 29, 2005 5:29 PM
I do believe there where "sith sords" (pre dark jedi sith) that where blaster reflctive and saber proofed pre saber
  luuke.skywalker
date Posted: Sep 30, 2005 10:21 AM
The lightsaber does not make the Jedi. But I want to know who came up with the crackpot theory that lightsabers weren't invented until 9990 BBY? The only explanation I've heard is that somewhere someone saw an ancient Jedi who didn't have one with him. Personally I think the original Jedi -- the founders -- were responsible for the invention of the lightsaber. I've seen no actual evidence to refute that. Just hearsay.
  Rive Caedo
Rive's Uncharted Settlements
date Posted: Sep 30, 2005 11:16 PM
I suspect the primary source is the Knights of the Old Republic video game series, and the Jedi Knight III: Jedi Academy game.

Knights of the Old Republic features a Sith spirit who (if you make the right choices) will provide you with his weapons, a group of Sith blades (non-lightsabers).

Jedi Knight III features the ancient Sith spirit of Marka Ragnos "possesing" a Dark Jedi and using his weapon, an energized traditional blade (so non-lightsaber, but has lightning pulsing up and down the blade).

Perhaps the comics also offer info, but I can't provide that first hand. :/
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